Question: Hello!!

Sorry about disturbing you !

I have question !

Of course you know that man first think with his instincts and then with his brain.

I was visiting erotic massage as it suppose to be very safe practice to avoid HIV transmission. And it is said in all literature. But I m thinking person , so I was reading literature and putting things together .

So as I said I hade erotic massage as man who wanted to get relax - and I choose it as it is the most safes intimate contact. So I had erotic massage contact with the sex commercial worker, and there was only her hands and breasts contact to my body and my penis – nothing more. After erotic massage I start to thin. As it is said that HIV virus is weak outside the body, and once it is dry it is inactive. And I was looking in literature how really long HIV survive outside body! As I was thinking if before me there was clients who practice the same erotic massage – so it is possible that there was sperm of erotic massage lady body, hands and breasts. And if she practice massage on my body and even potential body fluid was dry it still could be active and infective. And she did no use disinfection to clean her body. So I look in literature.

1.     Is is said looking in literature CDC
HIV does not survive long outside the human body (such as on surfaces), and it cannot reproduce outside a human host. It is not spread by
http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/basics/transmission.html


2.     I other literature
In certain conditions, the virus can survive outside the body for several weeks.
http://www.aidsmap.com/Survival-outside-the-body/page/0000/




Drying the virus on a glass surface or freezing caused a 5-12 fold and 4-5 fold decrease of activity, respectively
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/0000

And this article full text

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC263082/


3.     But in other article it is said that it could die in high temperature but in room temperature it could be rather stable and infective


Under our experimental conditions utilizing a highly concentrated viral preparation, virus with an initial infectious titer of approximately 7 log10 tissue culture infectious dose (TCID50) per milliliter can be recovered for more than a week from an aqueous environment held at room temperature (23 to 27 degrees C) or at 36 to 37 degrees C. Virus recovery is reduced at a rate of approximately 1 log10TCID50 per 20 minutes when held at 54 to 56 degrees C. Dried and held at room temperature, HTLV-III/LAV retains infectivity for more than three days with a reduction of approximately 1 log10TCID50 per nine hours

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/0000


I was looking for new publication but I didn’t find any new study – I don’t know why, I was looking also un pub med – but I didn’t find new publication.


So in conclusion

If erotic massage therapist had sperm on her body in dry form and if it could have high viral load as in early infection stage – and girl made my penis massage with her breasts and hands I m at risk of hiv infection ?


I think risk is rather low – as also massage oil change pH

In sperm HIV viral load is lower

And other factors

Could you please give me you comment !

Good luck for you !

Thank you for your help !

I m thinking person – that’s why I m reading and looking for publication !

1 . As you said it will become inactive after drying because viral load is not so high? And it will lose infectivity faster than in experiments where viral load is high









As in experiments it is said that if viral load is high up to 1 000 000 – 10 000 000 and dry sample is hold in room temperature





And Dried and held at room temperature, HTLV-III/LAV retains infectivity for more than three days with a reduction of approximately 1 log10TCID50 per nine hours

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC263082/pdf/jcm00002-0311.pdf

And also in other publication it is said that it could live long in room temperature with high viral load.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC263082/pdf/jcm00002-0311.pdf



And as looking in HIV viral load chart – such high viral load as used in experiment could be in HIV early stage and late stage as 1000 000 per ml
http://www.healthhype.com/cd4-count-dropping-viral-load-stable-in-hiv-infection-graph.html





2. So in conclusion if you get huge amount of dry blood or other body fluid with very high viral load contact like in early stage or late stage in room temperature and – your skin is brooked up you could get HIV infection.

Is it so ?




3.Is there some new experiments that proves that when hiv virus dry in room temperature it is inactive – because these publications are rather old.



And I could not find new publications about HIV surviving outside body like 2010 – 2016 it is because the results would be the same, and there is no new experiments.

4. .And how much is viral load drop by 1 log10TCID50 in numbers as it is said in one experiment?


Thank you

Thank you !

1.But I need argument – it will not transmit even dry material with high viral load because ….. ?

Could you give me arguments …..it is because …..

2. Could you find me please some new publication about high viral load and its infectivity in dry form ? Because those I find is old !



3. And how much is viral load drop by 1 log10TCID50 in numbers as it is said in one experiment?


4. As it is said in publication if viral load is high in room temperature it could live longer in dry form !




But they explain that - Despite this long survival time, we know of no evidence that HIV is capable of being transmitted via contaminated fomites, although the possibility of that risk cannot be excluded -




Despite the many variables which might affect the survival of HIV in the environment, our results can still be extrapolated to the in vivo situation. A maximum titer of HIV of 4 log units per ml has been recorded in the blood of patients with AIDS (15, 21) and in the blood of individuals with primary infection in which there were often transient high levels of viremia (9). Under our test conditions, loss of infectivity of such high titers would not occur until 4 to 8 weeks. Despite this long survival time, we know of no evidence that HIV is capable of being transmitted via contaminated fomites, although the possibility of that risk cannot be excluded. Virus present in many clinical specimens or spillages may lose infectivity within a few days. Most specimens contain only low concentrations of virus, and HIV is not known to be transmitted via any route other than by the already well documented ones of sexual contact, parenteral inoculation, vertical transmission, and transfusion or transplantation of contaminated organs, tissues, and blood products
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC263082/pdf/jcm00002-0311.pdf

Thank you

So only dry blood is better to transmit virus not sperm ? It is from publication ? Or from your knowledge ?


Your answer !

Even if the viral load is high the virus can survive in dried blood for not more than a week but on the contrary it is also true that it can not transmit the infection.


So dry blood can not transmit even hiv is active in that dry blood sample? Is it some mechanism that don’t allow infection to transmit eve virus particles is infective?

Thank you !

But all literature what I read it is said that still dry blood could be infective and there is to much misunderstood – and not correct understanding about hiv survive in dry environment !

Is is said in book disinfection - how important is not to think that dry blood is non infective
https://books.google.lv/books?id=3f-kPJ17_TYC&pg=PA574&lpg=PA574&dq=when+in+the+body+is+Cell-free+hiv&source=bl&ots=KmGkGx4RL2&sig=3sbIslwWmjAO4on0sgmcPi3UsEE&hl=lv&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiwktuti8bOAhVkYZoKHR5WD2IQ6AEIRjAF#v=onepage&q=when20is%20Cell-free%20hiv&f=false

And other page it is said how important is to sterilize instrument that penetrates the skin – manicure, pedicure, body piercing - and there is also said about misunderstood that dry blood ca not infect
https://dontgetstuck.org/introduction-3/prevention-lies-and-abuse/what-is-your-risk/

Please just look in short on them !


Of course hiv will not transmit by casual contact where small quantity of dry blood contact some broken skin !

And it is explained in hiv web page

Hiv wont spread
     By contact with small quantities of dried blood, because HIV will not be present in sufficient quantity (all infections through blood not injected or transfused have occurred where large quantities of blood splashed onto the broken skin of other people).
http://www.aidsmap.com/Impossible-routes/page/0000/     






So to end this discussion hiv could be transmitted if you penetrate the skin with dry blood instrument – but it will not transmit in casual way.

I hope we will booth agree to this statement !

Good luck

Thank you

For your help – Just one short question about HIV – how much particles is needed to infect some on !

I was doing research for better understanding – And there was material.


The 50% infective dose of HIV in blood exposures ranges from one virion (two copies RNA) in primary infection with CCR5 co-receptor using strains of HIV-1 to 65,000 copies HIV-1 RNA in blood from an asymptomatic source patient. The median transmission risks for unsafe intravenous or intramuscular injections using equipment cleaned but not sterilized after use on a symptomatic pre-AIDS patient are 1.8% (95% confidence interval [CI] 0.1-3.2%) and 0.8% (95% CI 0.1-1.4%), respectively
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/0000


And here is full text explanation
http://www.who.int/injection_safety/toolbox/2009_Review-on-infective-dose-for-HIV-infection.pdf

So as I understand there should be 4 copies (as it would be 100 %) of HIV RNA to transmit HIV to someone. But as I understand the dose is lover because it is infected in blood stream.




Did I correctly understand it ?


Thank you very much for your help !