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What Causes Recurrent Ulcers In Mouth Despite Taking Medication?

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Posted on Mon, 19 Oct 2015
Question: my uncle aged 60 heavy smoker suffering from mouth ulcers for d past 20 days. .BECELAC controlled d 1st one effectively which is on right side..after 1 week went to a dentist for plucking teeth..gave anaesthetic 5 times on top of the lower lip while plucking. .severe pain even after anaesthetic n he saw a bigger ulcer on top of the lower lip. .DICLOMOL MUCOPAIN XXXXXXX FOLVITE KETOROL-DT medicines suggested..no relief. went to ENT SPECIALIST n he gave OMNOCORTIL DICLOMOL METROGYL GEL for 4 days. .no relief. .again took ZYTEE GEL n BECOSULES CAPSULE..75% controlled. .got a new ulcer on the left side also. .is it because of high dose of anaesthesia r some thing else? ?..should I go for any other tests r simple medication is suggested? ? it's not healing quickly. .plz help me..
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (22 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Possible Herpetiform ulcers.No investigations are needed as of now.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

The recurrent ulcers in your uncle's case are directly precipitated by the drugs like Omnocortil, Metrogyl and Diclomol.

Also, anesthetic agents can precipitate these new ulcers.

These ulcers considering the age of your uncle are likely to be herpetiform in nature.Their onset is heralded by above-mentioned drugs and anaesthetics.

Occasionally in elderly people, who are heavy smokers transient immune system disturbances can occur which can lead to reactivation of viral ulcers.

You need not go for any further tests.

Along with Zytee gel and Becosules ,I generally treat my patients with oral tablets of Conviron forte and Matilda ER for 1-2 months(Iron and Vitamin B12 supplementation).I suggest you to please see a doctor if his views are same and if can prescribe these drugs for you.

These medications should effectively cure the ulcers in 1-2 weeks time.

Further investigations may be needed only these ulcers does not subside in 2 weeks.

Post your further queries if any.

Thank you.



Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (6 days later)
my aunt was diagnised with brain metastases (2) in the frontal lobe with unknown primary with MRI CONTRAST n PET-CT scan..we did not opt for shrgical biopsy as it was risky considering her age (60)..she has been on CORTICO STEROIDS n ANTI CONVULSANTS since diagnosis...took radiation therapy (SRS-IMRT) for 3 weeks..her left leg n hand r completely weak. .DECMAX 8mg n LEVIPIL 750mg r d medication for 2 months...her both legs have been swelling so much for d past 3 days..she is completely bedridden since diagnosis. .what could be suggested for dis swelling..next scan is still 1 week away..kindly help plz..
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (18 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Leg swelling is directly related to Decmax use.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

The swelling of both legs is directly related to the use of Decmax .

This drug is known to cause fluid retention.

You would have gone ahead for surgical biopsy. This is not risky as you have anticipated. Also the risk benefit ratio post biospy would be still higher.

You are prescribed the standard therapy with anticonvulsants and corticosteroids to prevent elevated pressure in the brain subsequent to metastatic deposits.

Next scan will give good info pertaining to the response to treatment with SRS-IMRT.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.
Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (3 hours later)
sir is the swelling in d legs a cause of concern??patient is so weak that we can't take her 2 hospital right now.. there is swelling in d shoulders also..can you suggest any medication for this??
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (5 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Diuretic use under medical supervision is the main stay of treatment.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

The swelling in legs and shoulders is related to generalised salt and water retention in the body secondary to the action of DECMAX, which is a strong steroidal drug.

This can be a concern, as it can lead serious electrolyte and acid-base disturbances in the body.

Also, there is a propensity for heart failure with fluid overload in the body.

This condition has to treated with drugs like diuretics(ex Frusemide) only after monitoring the serum electrolytes closely since the origin is secondary to a brain malignancy.

The correction has to be balanced, to avoid the risk of brain damage in all such conditions because too rapid changes in serum sodium subsequent to diuretic use can induce irreversible brain damage.

Hence, I advise you to seek the help of a Home-based Physician to attend your aunt and discuss the need for Diuretic therapy.

Post your further queries if any.

Thank you.






Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (4 days later)
Welcome agn sir...it's been 15 days since you mentioned ZYTEE GEL CONVIRON FORTE & MATILDA ER for my uncle's(heavy smoker n age 60) mouth ulcers which r herpetiform in nature. .there is relief for him right now but the white patch on top of lower lip started to form again for the last 2 days....there no pain as of now..he wants to have his teeth plucked with a dentist..can he go for it r he has to go for any tests regarding that new white patch formed.. r else any medication is suggested??kindly guide us plz...
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (17 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Please upload images.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

I apologize for my delayed response.

I request you to upload the image of the white patch on top of the lower lip.

This will help me to formulate an accurate hypothesis and guide you appropriately with regards to its management and treatment protocol.

Thank you.




Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (16 minutes later)
I'm sending the images of the white patch..also he is feeling that his urine is smelling a bit harder than usual..is it bcoz of the tablets r something else???
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (21 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Possible Oral Thrush with Urinary infection?Need confirmation.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

I apologize for the delayed response, owing to my hectic schedule.

I have gone through your uploaded images.

These patches could be fungal(infection)in origin likely to be oral thrush.Such infections are common in chronic smokers with COPD.

Neither of the 3 medications- Zytee gel, Matilda ER or Conviron is involved in the causation of the same.In fact, many of them prevent such white patch formation.

Dental extraction is strongly contraindicated at this stage.Postpone it until the white patch resolves and urine infection resolves.

I advise you to get a Random Blood sugar and Urine test-Urine Albumin, Sugar and Microscopy.Please make sure to give the sample before taking any antibiotics.

At this point, I generally prescribe my patients with oral tablets of FLUCONAZOLE 200 mg once followed by 150 mg on day 2 and 3.This should be able to clear the fungal infection.Please check with your doctor if he shares my opinion and if can prescribe them to your uncle.

In case the patch does not clear with oral antifungal therapy within a week, it becomes mandate to get a biopsy of the patch to rule out Leukoplakia(precursor lesion in chronic heavy smokers it has the propensity to cause cancer of the oral cavity and lip.Leukoplakia progress through 3 more stages before turning into cancer.Hence, this stage(leukoplakia) is potentially reversible and curable.Hence, an early detection is a mandate.Hope you understand.This is second line suspicion after oral thrush.

Review with test reports for further assessment.

Post your further queries if any.
Thak you











Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (23 hours later)
hello sir I'm sending detailed reports of my uncles RANDOM BLOOD SUGAR and COMPLETE URINE EXAMINATION...from yesterday he was using FLUCONAZOLE tablets..we'll continue them if you ask us..if everything is normal in the reports..then wat should we do..is BIOPSY a feasible option right now??also there has been removal of minor poertions of skin inner portion of his cheeks just beside his teeth..is this a cause of concern just guide us plz...
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (25 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Biopsy not now

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I apologize for the delayed response.

I have gone through your uploaded reports.

Continue Fluconazole as prescribed for 3 days as 1-2 pus cells is noted on HPF.

A biopsy is not a feasible option right now.As earlier advised -In case the patch does not clear with oral antifungal therapy within a week, it becomes a mandate to get a biopsy of the patch. Hence, you can wait for a week to see if it resolves on its own.In case if it completely resolves in 7-10 days, then obviously you do not need a biopsy.

Wait to see if the skin/mucous membrane peeling will resolve shortly.It does not need special therapy as of now.Continue Matilda ER and Conviron forte.Stop Zytee Gel.

Review after 1 week-ten days.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.


Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (3 days later)
hello sir welcome again..my uncle has been using FLUCONAZOLE for d past 5 days..shall he continue with the medication for 5 more days as u told furthercreview after 1week r 10 days..for your understanding I'm sending the images of uncles present condition. .just go through them n let us know if there is any improvement. .also if biopsy is needed when should he go for it?? is there anything to worry about right now??
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (16 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Time for the biopsy.Possible HOL

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

I have gone through the uploaded images as well.

The size of white patch ahs diminished, but not completely resolved.

This seems to Oral Leukoplakia/OL (possibly homogenous type-HOL) to me.
Risk factors -Chronic smoking and Dental disease are present.
We have tried Vitamin, Iron and Antifungal drugs to see for its resolution.But this is still left behind.

Discontinue smoking.It is most important.
Consult Dentist for correction of dental problems.
Continue Iron and Vitamin supplements.

It is now time to investigate further.

It is now important to get a Biopsy for Confirmation.

Once diagnosed, Cryotherapy ablation Or carbon dioxide laser ablation are also used. The area heals rapidly, and apparently healthy mucosa is left behind.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.






Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (2 days later)
thanks a lot sir..I wanna ask a not-related to my uncles question ..i previouly mentioned my aunts suffering with brain metastases..it's been 1.5 months since she had radiation therapy. .since then her condition has been deteriorating so much that now she can't sit upright. .urination n excretion r both on bed only. her CNS is damaged n muscles have lost stiffness completely. .in the recent scan multiple tumors have appeared on her right frontal lobe along with previous 2 lesions . . some of then r showing central necrosis. .her left leg n left hand r completely paralyzed. .is there any possibility of getting her into a coma state? ?also from now on approximately how long she can survive? ??doctors have told us there is no treatment as of now. .if she gets into a coma is there any chance of reversing it?? for v ur understanding im uploading the recent morri
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (19 hours later)
Brief Answer:
The median survival is her case is 6 months.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, Sir.

I understand your concern.

I apologise for the delayed response owing to my hectic work schedule.

The possibility of a comatose state in her case is high, especially if the metastatic deposits involve "Brain stem" region or if the Metabolic encephalopathy ensues.

It is difficult to revive patients from such a comatose states.It can be very difficult to predict recovery when a person is a coma.

The prognosis for a coma varies with each situation. The chances of a person's recovery depend on the cause of the coma, whether the problem can be corrected, and the duration of the coma. If the problem can be resolved, the person can often return to his or her original level of functioning. Sometimes, though, if the brain damage is severe, a person may be permanently disabled or never regain consciousness.

Treatment for a coma depends on the cause.In general, treatment for a coma is supportive.

The presence of new lesions with central necrosis is a poor prognostic sign .

Brain metastatic deposits with an unknown primary is very refractory to treatment.

Given the current clinical profile, it seems prudent that she lost Cortical(higher functions) grossly.This can also result in Metabolic encephalopathy.

The median survival of patients with brain metastasis without a primary cancer is about 6 months.This is influenced by the presence of complications arising out of radiation therapy, the presence of new lesions and metabolic impact on the body.

Post your further queries if any,
Thank you.


Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (29 minutes later)
dear XXXXXXX sir grateful to u for giving such a detailed explanation. .her cortical is lost..she has her lesions in the right frontal lobe..she is experiencing severe headaches right now..is there any chance of restoration of CORTICAL so that any glimmer of hope for her to walk again. .also for your understanding im sending u the recent MRI scan images..sending u 2 images which consist of the first one taken 2.5 months back n second one just 10 days back..in between she took radiation therapy..medication right now is LEVIPIL 500 WYSOLONE N FRISIUM..For headaches we r using DOLO 650..she is unable to take solids as food only liquids..suffering from constipation for d last one week..no excretion for 6 days..are her kidneys also damaged???can you suggest a better medication for headaches n constipation plz?? based on the images I'm sending u I s there any chance of lesions forming in the stem??I explained you her position right now just guide us with some medication n some palliative measures plz...
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (30 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Possibility of cortical reversal is virtually impossible

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I apologise for the delayed response.Thanks for bearing with me.

I understand your concern.I have gone through the uploaded images.

The chance of a reversal of cortical loss is impossible.Brain tissue once lost is lost forever.Hence, it is virtually impossible for her to walk again.

The possibility of kidney damage is high since there is no urine output in the last 6 days.Hence, a renal ultrasound with blood urea and creatine measurements are important at this point.

A headache in her case is secondary to elevated intracranial tension in the brain secondary to the mass effect of metastatic deposits.DOLO is the best drug at this moment.This headache will not respond to analgesics rather.

This is better handled by WYSOLONE.Hence, any change of analgesics will have an additional load on the kidney.Hence better to stick with DOLO.

The probability of detecting brainstem metastasis is difficult from the images you uploaded.The brain stem is a deeper infratentorial structure, whereas the cerebral cortex is supratentorial structure.I can guide you better if you can upload the hard copy of the scan report.

For constipation, Syrup Smuth is an excellent option.Rectal Dulcolax single dose also will be very effective.Please check with your physician with regards to prescription.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.







Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (7 days later)
Dear XXXXXXX sir as you correctly described my aunt is in coma right now. .to be precise she is unaware of the surroundings does not open her eyes as if she is in a deep sleep n snoring is also there. . .her muscles are completely paralysed. .can't even take liquids a food (6 days since she took fluids).if we try go give water it will come out from the sides of the lips. Is there any use with saline intake. .sometimes she takes very deep breaths n sometimes normal. .she is able to move her pupils whenever we try to move her head by opening her eyes. .dryness on her skin. .yesterday ants have invaded her body parts within 15 mins of our lapse in concentration. .there r blood scars on her body through out n there is swelling around vaginal parts. .i.e a lump of mass(size of a tennis ball) is seen around her vagina. .her pulse beating has not also been uniform. .sometimes we don't feel it n sometimes it is normal..whenever its completely down we would feel as if death is near. .but that's not d case for the past 6 days. .heart beat n breathing n pulse ups n downs r d present state. .we don't know what's going through her body. .how long we have to wait for her to come out of coma r prepare for death..just v tell us what should we do now plz? ? We r completely disoriented..should we silently for the final thing r can we do something? ?? Plz suggest something sir. .
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (16 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Admit her in ICU soon

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I understand your concern.

I apologize for the delayed response.

I feel sorry for her deteriorating condition.

This could be impending metabolic encephalopathy or brainstem metastasis.

It will be great if you get her admitted in a hospital since many causes of metabolic encephalopathy can be reversed.

Please be patient and maintain calmness.

The overall prognosis at this stage is very poor.

In a hospital setting, doctors will run a complete panel of tests and can detect reversible causes of coma. This can be the last try.

Hence, please admit her in an intensive care unit.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.




Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Vaishalee Punj
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (26 hours later)
dear XXXXXXX sir how can it be she is still able to breathe normally even though she is without any food r fluids not even water. .we r in a remote village n there's no hospital facility nearby to get her admitted in ICU. .also why she is not getting convulsions r stroke because of the tumors in her frontal lobe??is it due to muscle paralysis due to loss of cortical n subsequent metabolic encephalopathy? ??can you just explain us why there's not a significant decrement of her metabolism even without any intake for the past 1week..can you just guide us on how long she can survive if this state continues??
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (17 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Under such circumstances lifespan falls under 2 weeks.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I understand your concern.

Yes the possibility of muscle paralysis and metabolic encephalopathy is high.

Seizures may occcur in such states eventhough they may be typical as you expected.

Respiration is an autonomic function, it can continue for some time irrespective of the body's state.This is not of any significance.

If this state continues without any treatment, the lifespan will be grossly fall down to less than 2 weeks.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.


Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (25 minutes later)
dear XXXXXXX sir thanx a lot ..we Wil wait for the inevitable. .thats all we can do..can you please suggest any medication for muscle cramps r some nerve twitching which occurred while playing cricket some 20 days ago. .whenever I try to get up after sitting for a while. .the leg is just not picking up. ..i have to wait for some time before it gets settled. .for the past 5 days it's been worse. .my age is 36..
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (16 minutes later)
Brief Answer:
Tab Aceclo-Sera will help.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I understand your concern.

For your symptoms, I generally recommend oral tablets of Aceclo-Sera and Neurokind for 1 week.Please check with your physician if he can prescribe the same to you.

Thank you.
Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Chakravarthy Mazumdar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (6 days later)
dear XXXXXXX sir as per ur suggestion we wanted to have a biopsy for my uncle's white patch n consulted a surgeon regarding this..he simply told us,by looking at the patch on base of the lower lip n the d white patches on both sides of his cheeks(more thickish on right side),that it is oral leukoplakia n does not need a biopsy to confirm this n also no need to worry abt cancer at this stage..he gave a nod for dental extraction n follow ups every 6 months. he took an X ray on base of the lower lip n found out there is one more tooth inside..he gave precautions abt dental extractions n bridge setting abt that extra tooth..I simply wanna ask u what should we do now?? should my uncle go for dental extraction r he has to go for treatment for oral leukoplakia?? we need ur guidance regarding this XXXXXXX sir..
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (5 hours later)
Brief Answer:
Go ahead with your doctor's advise.

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I understand your concern.

Ok , I have gone through your query in detail.

Yes, you can proceed with dental extraction.

Ill fitting tooth are one of the common causes of leukoplakia.

Extraction of such teeth can result in reversal of leukoplakia in many cases.

Since your doctor has confirmed it as leukoplakia, the need for biopsy is now not necessary.

Proceed with dental extraction and see if leukoplakia resolves on its own within 1-3 months of teeth removal.

Thank you.




Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Neel Kudchadkar
doctor
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Follow up: Dr. Suresh Heijebu (1 hour later)
dear XXXXXXX sir previously when he went for dental extraction n total teeth set up..because of anaesthesia n some mouth ulcer precipitating medication he suffered for 1 month. .if say same situation repeats tomorrow what should be done? ?plz don't forget he is a chronic smoker n he has not reduced smoking let alone quitting. .that's his biggest weakness ..my question is with this kind of smoking n leukoplakia is it feasible to go for dental extraction?? is there any possibility of recurrence of those patches all over the mouth? ? I m concerned about 2 factors SMOKING n ANAESTHESIA. .one more thing sir surgeon told us that as long as he does not quit smoking condition will be same. .he did not stress about that inner tooth XXXXXXX sir. .to tell u the truth these people don't prefer online suggestions ..you simply tell us sir what is the best option right now? ?
doctor
Answered by Dr. Suresh Heijebu (1 hour later)
Brief Answer:
Dentral extraction has more benefits than risks in him

Detailed Answer:
Hello, XXXXXXX

I understand your concern.

The major cause of leukoplakia in his case is smoking.

This alone contributes to 60% cause.

The ill fitted teeth has contributed to the rest 40%.

Mouth ulcers in the past due a precipitating medication might not relate to the onset or causative factor for leukoplakia. It is a distinct entity which has originated exclusively out of smoking and ill fitting teeth.

Additionally anesthesia will not exacerbate leukoplakia.

But the possibility of mouth ulcers is there -10% risk with anesthesia. But they can be managed.

One thing what your surgeon said is very clear. Unless he quits smoking, leukoplakia will not vanish. This is 100% a fact.

As I already said, leukoplakia is a precursor lesion of the oral cavity cancer.
Hence a periodical follow up is required.

At this stage, once after the teeth removal, he has to quit smoking at least in a staged manner.

He will be a lucky man if the current leukoplakia will completely vanish with teeth extraction alone. Hence, do not be much concerned over teeth extraction. It seems to be a good option at this stage.

Post your further queries if any.
Thank you.


The removal of these ill fitting teeth will only reduce that 30% risk.

XXXX

Note: Consult an experienced Otolaryngologist / ENT Specialist online for further follow up on ear, nose, and throat issues - Book a Call now.

Above answer was peer-reviewed by : Dr. Raju A.T
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Dr. Suresh Heijebu

Psychiatrist

Practicing since :2010

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What Causes Recurrent Ulcers In Mouth Despite Taking Medication?

Brief Answer: Possible Herpetiform ulcers.No investigations are needed as of now. Detailed Answer: Hello, Sir. I understand your concern. The recurrent ulcers in your uncle's case are directly precipitated by the drugs like Omnocortil, Metrogyl and Diclomol. Also, anesthetic agents can precipitate these new ulcers. These ulcers considering the age of your uncle are likely to be herpetiform in nature.Their onset is heralded by above-mentioned drugs and anaesthetics. Occasionally in elderly people, who are heavy smokers transient immune system disturbances can occur which can lead to reactivation of viral ulcers. You need not go for any further tests. Along with Zytee gel and Becosules ,I generally treat my patients with oral tablets of Conviron forte and Matilda ER for 1-2 months(Iron and Vitamin B12 supplementation).I suggest you to please see a doctor if his views are same and if can prescribe these drugs for you. These medications should effectively cure the ulcers in 1-2 weeks time. Further investigations may be needed only these ulcers does not subside in 2 weeks. Post your further queries if any. Thank you.